Aminet 15/Aminet 15 - Nov 1996.iso/Aminet/comm/fido/fnewsa.lzh/fido1038.nws

Text File | 1993-09-19 | 64KB | 1,301 lines

F I D O  N E W S --                   Vol.10  No.38    (20-Sep-1993)
+----------------------------+-----------------------------------------+
|  A newsletter of the       |                                         |
|  FidoNet BBS community     |         Published by:                   |
|          _                 |                                         |
|         /  \               |      "FidoNews" BBS                     |
|        /|oo \              |       [phone]     1:1/23        |
|       (_|  /_)             |                                         |
|        _`@/_ \    _        |       Editors:                          |
|       |     | \   \\       |         Sylvia Maxwell    1:221/194     |
|       | (*) |  \   ))      |         Donald Tees       1:221/192     |
|       |__U__| /  \//       |         Tim Pozar         1:125/555     |
|        _//|| _\   /        |                                         |
|       (_/(_|(____/         |                                         |
|             (jm)           |      Newspapers should have no friends. |
|                            |                     -- JOSEPH PULITZER  |
+----------------------------+-----------------------------------------+
|               Submission address: editors 1:1/23                     |
+----------------------------------------------------------------------+
|  Internet addresses:                                                 |
|                                                                      |
|    Sylvia -- [e-mail]                       |
|    Donald -- [e-mail]                    |
|    Tim    -- [e-mail]                                      |
|    Both Don & Sylvia    (submission address)                         |
|              [e-mail]                    |
+----------------------------------------------------------------------+
|       For  information,   copyrights,   article   submissions,       |
|       obtaining copies and other boring but important details,       |
|       please refer to the end of this file.                          |
+----------------------------------------------------------------------+
========================================================================
                          Table of Contents
========================================================================

1.  Editorial.....................................................  2
2.  Articles......................................................  2
      Clarification of Maximus Y)ell Problem......................  2
      The Hypothetical Hypocritical Hypochondriac SysOp...........  5
      Shawn McMahon...............................................  6
      MAIL FROM TOM JENNINGS......................................  7
      Splitting Area Codes........................................  8
      Info-ZIP utility - a .ZIP alternative....................... 12
      EPubNet - Electronic Publishing Pioneers.................... 14
      "The Fight for Privacy: The Govt. Raises the Stakes"........ 15
      "ZIP Archivers Update"...................................... 20
      The Joy of FidoNet!......................................... 20
      Replies to FidoNews 10-36................................... 20
      (The Innocents)............................................. 22
3.  Fidonews Information.......................................... 22
FidoNews 10-38                 Page:  2                    20 Sep 1993


========================================================================
                              Editorial
========================================================================
    First, a short note of apology to Mr. Scott Dudley.  Scott
points off a system that feeds from us, so there was no excuse
for us not forwarding last week's article to him ... he should
have FIRST heard of the problem through mail, not the snooze.

    The article in question, however, has a couple of other
things that should be brought up.   Normally, if we received an
article that told how to crash a BBS, we would not print it
until after the author had a fix out.  In this case, however, I
received the notes on the problem from three separate sources.
One of those was a local BBS which had been crashed, and one was
through an international file echo.  Since the problem had been
so widely announced, I felt that widely announcing the solution
was in order.  There was, however, no excuse for not forwarding
a copy to Scott.

    On other fronts, articles are starting to trickle in
regarding E-zines.  Several are included in this week's issue.
We expect several more over the next few weeks, and are also
amassing a collection of general information on the subject.
Perhaps a special issue on e-pubs is in order?  Please send MORE
MAIL, this is great.

========================================================================
                               Articles
========================================================================
Clarification of Maximus Y)ell Problem

Scott Dudley
1:249/106

Recently, a message was posted in various echoes (and in
FidoNews, SOFTDIST, alt.ranting.and.raving, etc.) regarding a
problem with the Y)ell command under a stock Maximus 2.0/DOS
system.  Some parts of the post were correct, but some other
parts were incorrect as well, so I would like to clarify a few
points.

The stated cause and effect are correct, but the explanation for
"why" makes the problem sound bigger than it really should be.

In short, to fix the problem, change the YELLREQ.MEC line to
remove the "%J" and make it read "User yelled for the sysop".

For those who are interested in a longer description of the
problem, read on.

The following quotes are from the original "the sky is falling"
post:

>+-+--+--+--+--+--+--+--+--+--+--+--+--+--+--+--+--+--+--+-
FidoNews 10-38                 Page:  3                    20 Sep 1993

>WARNING TO ALL MAXIMUS SYSOPS!  READ THIS!  VERY IMPORTANT
>+-+--+--+--+--+--+--+--+--+--+--+--+--+--+--+--+--+--+--+-

>There is a very easy way for a user to crash your Max board it
>was brought to my attention by Ming Ho (1:250/526).  One a
>couple of occasions, a Maximus board known as "The OH! Zone"
>(non-Fido B) was crashed by the user issuing the following
>commands; first, they would use the yell option, and then for
>the reason, they put:

>                               %16,%f,e.t.c

Up to here, the message is correct.  Max will have problems if
the user enters the string "%f" as part of a yell request.
>Although the "e.t.c" part more than likely means nothing, the
>"%" means a lot to Dos.  I have thoroughly tested this on my
>system.  It *does* work.  There is a simple solution for it
>however (which I've also tested).

  [...]

>The reason you do this is because if you don't, there will be an
>FPU error. Much like as in a programming language, Dos cannot
>store the wrong data-type in a wrongfully declared memory
>region. It has no 'type-caste' precautions built-in to it and
>consequently doesn't know how to handle a statement such as
>above, i.e. the reason it's crashing is because the user is
>making an illegal call to the memory regions of the machine--
>this is why the system crashes, and you *must* hard-boot it!

This is not true.  The exact cause of the problem is as follows:

After the user enters a request containing a "%f", the [log]
MECCA token passes this string to the function that adds a line
to the Max log file.  (The token "%J" is replaced by the string
entered by the user, and if that string happens to include a %f,
the problem will appear.)

As part of the logfile processing, the log() function calls
printf() on the string entered by the user.  This was my mistake,
since the printf function uses the "%" character as a special
sequence for embedding user-specified text in the output string.
The "%" should have been automatically escaped  before being
passed to the log function; this will be done in future versions
of Maximus.

However, this would normally not be a problem.  Although no
specific arguments were specified for that user-defined text, the
printf function would have simply read (NOT write) garbage
arguments from the stack.  This would cause a bit of garble to
appear on the screen, but other than that, it would be harmless.

However, the reason that this causes a problem is that the "%f"
command tells Maximus to display a floating-point number.  To
support floating point, C applications need to be linked with a
FidoNews 10-38                 Page:  4                    20 Sep 1993

special library which provides that support.  Max does not need
to use floating point numbers, so that support was not included.

Consequently, when the format string was interpreted by the
printf function, it realized that floating point was not
supported, so it printed an appropriate error message.  After
displaying that message, the printf function terminates the
program abnormally.

Again, this would not normally be of concern, except for one
problem:

When Max starts up, it hooks a couple of interrupt vectors
corresponding to the keyboard handler.  When Max terminates
normally, these vectors are set back to their original values, as
they existed before Max was started.

However, when Max is terminated abnormally, it does not get a
chance to restore these vectors.  This means that, after Max ends
and another program is loaded, these vectors will be pointing
into some random piece of code in the other program.  This causes
a system crash the next time that one of these interrupts are
executed.

Other than removing the "%J" in the yellreq.mec file, another way
to solve the problem is to use "MARK" and "RELEASE" around
max.exe.  As long as MARK is run just before max.exe is called,
and as long as RELEASE is called IMMEDIATELY after max.exe has
terminated, your system should not crash.  The
floating-point-not-loaded error will still be displayed, but the
system should keep on running.  This is because the crash problem
is caused directly by the aforementioned problem in Max's
interrupt vector management, not indirectly by the string entered
by the user.

The problem does not have anything to do with DOS, type-casting,
or the user making an illegal call to portions of the machine.
The problem does not allow any users to access anything that they
should not be able to access, so it is not a security problem.
However, it is a bug which can cause your system to crash when
the "magic string" is entered.

This problem only applies to Max-DOS.  Although the user can
cause a copy of Max-OS/2 to terminate abnormally, since OS/2 does
not allow the application to modify interrupt vectors, Max-OS/2
will simply recycle instead of causing a system crash.  This does
not cause much of a problem, other than the fact that it will
automatically hang up on the user when it does so.

Please address any concerns about this problem to me by DIRECT
NETMAIL, which is where the problem should have been reported to
begin with.  Although it is normally a good thing to distribute
the fix for a problem as widely as possible, I am slightly
disappointed that the cause of the problem was advertised all
across the world, without any attempt to contact the author!
FidoNews 10-38                 Page:  5                    20 Sep 1993

Even then, advertising the method used to crash the system did
nothing but create unnecessary problems.

Scott Dudley (Maximus author)
1:249/106


----------------------------------------------------------------------

The Hypothetical Hypocritical Hypochondriac SysOp
The saga continues...........
by George Dorn

Please note that the story that follows is pure fiction, and any
similarity between the persons described and any persons who are
currently or have in the past breathed the mixture of gases that
we generally refer to as the atmosphere of the planet Earth are
purely coincidental.

The person described herein may be considered a cowardly,
hypocritical, hypochondriac, unfit for membership of the human
race.  If any particular SysOp thinks the story applies to them
in some way, well maybe they're paranoid as well.  They could
also be right ;-) Is mental instability a basis for removal of a
SysOp I wonder?

Once upon a time, there was a SysOp out in FidoLand, who
developed a secondary hobby.  Communication, via electronic
means was deemed to be so powerful that it could be used for the
imposition of one's own moral standard upon others and if this
were not succesful then reticent offenders could be brought to the
attention of the authorities.  All the tools were in place, A
computer, terminal emulator and modem were all that were needed.
Oh, almost forgot, a total lack of a sense of morality as well
as total ignorance of one's own cowardice were also needed, but
these are easy to come by in certain parts of our beloved region
25.

So, armed with a handful of aliases, a vindictive attitude and
an acute sense of superiority, our hero sets out upon his quest.
Every day, he calls BBSs around the country, logs on and
attempts to extract as much information as possible about
suspected wrong-doings, wrong-doings in his (warped) mind that
is.  If anything, ANYTHING boys and girls, even remotely tastes
of sexual activity then the log files are duly shipped off to
the local constabulary (police for our American brethren), under
an assumed name, of course.  Our hero is never about to do
anything under his real name, this would imply taking
responsibility and this is to be avoided at all costs.

If this hobby were not enough to keep our intrepid hero
happy, he has another.  Not satisfied with dragging his fellow
hobbyists into disrepute with his BBS activities (his behaviour
is widely known in the UK) he has lately taken to writing
accusatory articles, attacking SysOps in other countries, in
FidoNews 10-38                 Page:  6                    20 Sep 1993

FidoNews.  For this he has either been anonymous or has used one
of his favourite psuedonyms.

If you come across this poor excuse for a human being, in your
BBS, then take EXTRA care, the slime of humanity could be after
your blood.

Names he has used in various BBSs around the UK as well as in
FidoNet articles are

Rob Austin                   Andy Brimson
Charles Wilberforce          Jim/James Weir or Skittle
Mike Eoman / Goman           Richard Perkins
Stuart Green                 George Dorn

No doubt some of you wil recognise some of the above names.
God! One of them is even mine!

So, the moral of this story is simple, and is there for all to
see, do not be fooled boys and girls, there really are arseholes
around.

For further information, Paul Dickie may be contacted by NetMail
on 2:256/62

George Dorn


----------------------------------------------------------------------

Shawn McMahon
1:206/1701.666

This is an open letter of apology to the Fidonews Editors.

You are indeed correct that your netmail didn't get to me;  I'll
be referring my bossnode to your note in the 'news.

You  are  also correct that my articles didn't meet ARTSPEC.DOC.
I have just FREQed a new copy and refamiliarized myself with it.

However, you are not correct that the problem  was  the  tables;
every line in that table was under 72 characters.

In fact, they were all under 70.

The  individual  text  lines  were  over  72,  and I'd named the
article with a .TXT extension instead of the proper .ART.

I just wanted to clear that up.

Thanks for the great job you've been doing.  See ya on the net...
FidoNews 10-38                 Page:  7                    20 Sep 1993


MAIL FROM TOM JENNINGS

> What is the rainbow crowd?

The Rainbow Family is a giant (10,000+) nomadic cultural thing in North
America. They look more or less like "hippies". You don't see to much of
them usually. They are genuinely nomadic, and hold various Gatherings,
usually a big annual one. Each year in a different US state. About
10,000 people show up, sometimes less. They take advantage of US Federal
homesteading laws, much to the chagrin of authorities. Gatherings are
free, and everyone pitches in -- or not. They don't worry about it.
There are communal meals (pretty minimal though, poverty is an
assumption so far in the background it's startling) made up of
donated/liberated/dumpster-dived food. They are
 not necesseraily
vegetarians. They have no or barter or minimal economy. I have an
ex-roommate who is a Rainbow person now. They are definitely way far
outside the usual channels. They're quite serious. They tend to be
vehicle-people, white, babies'n'dogs. They disdain alcohol, smoke lots
of pot. Usually quite trsutworthy. They are dirty.

Their methodology for gatherings is unique. They have a "welcome
committee" up where vehicles come in, who tell you where things are,
where to park, etc. They also scope people out; if they have alcohol --
generally the only thing forbidden besides firearms -- instead of a
lecture or whatever, they say "got any alcohol? Let's drink it! Here's
some of my pot!" and try to get the owner to consume it on the spot.
Usually works.

Two years back, in Nevada, the Great Circle gave Welcome Committee duty
to the Faerie camp (the gay/lez bunch within the Family) because they
did an excellent job of (1) defusing a bunch of asshole bigots with fun
instead of anger and (2) "took over" a small stage devolving into bland
ordinary faux hippy folksy music and turned it into a big open party. It
was a great honor, apparently.

Too much hippy for me, though the gatherings are definitly worth
checking out. They are always the first week in July.

A Council of oldtimers (which apparently anyone can attend and provide
input, listened to or not I know not) picks the next years site, many
months in advance. A few months before, a seed group goes to the site,
and chooses a location distractingly near the real site. This draws fire
from the locals and authorities, if any trouble arises, and keeps eyes
of the actual site. They usually rent an apt or something an have a
stable mail address. Word is spread mouth to mouth and hand to hand. No
advertising of any sort is generally done, and as far as I can tell, is
frowned upon. They deal with legal issues (more and more every year I
guess) and all that.

About a month before the actual event, another seed group populates the
site and starts to prepare it. In Nevada, it took place partly on
private land; the worked out a deal with the owner that they would leave
it utterly spotless and would install a water system based upon a
FidoNews 10-38                 Page:  8                    20 Sep 1993

water-hammer ("free" water pump power).

I can attest to the cleanliness thing. In nevada, I was there and left
early, so there were only a few thousand people. It was *spotless*. On a
mian trail, someone had dropped about a half-dozen cellophane candy
wrappers. It was a Big Deal. It was an issue at the Great Circle, and
instead of castigation and finger pointing (they the do all this stuff
internally of course, at big gatherings they tend to be fairly cool cuz
there's fresh faces and fresh energy) they went on about how important
it was they left the place clean. Seems to work.

It's a retty cool thing, iff you like hippies, eating oatmeal as your
main source of nutrition, walking 6 hours into the woods, carrying
water, being asked to eat food just cooked as you walk down a trail,
LSD, get really dirty, dig shitters, keep damnfools from shitting in the
stream, etc etc. There are some christian hippies. There are more queer
ones. I hate tie-dye, and mistrust peace and loveism. I own guns and
like computers. Oh well.


----------------------------------------------------------------------

Splitting Area Codes

Spltting Area Codes

by David Leibold 1:250/730

Starting 4 October 1993, Bell Canada will split the area code 416
in the Toronto region into two area codes: numbers in Metropolitan
Toronto only will retain the 416 area code, while previous 416 area
code numbers outside Toronto will have their area code changed to 905.
There will be a six month period in which the 416 area code will
continue to operate as before, but with the new 905 area code in
operation. After 25 March 1994, 416 will no longer be valid for phone
numbers outside Metropolitan Toronto and the split will be complete.

Area code splits such as this have been all the rage in North America
in recent years, adding a challenge to keeping the Fidonet nodelist
up-to-date. The North American Numbering Plan (NANP), as the format of
area codes and telephone numbers is known, was quite stable until the
1980s when a splitting spree began. A list of recent and upcoming area
code splits in North America can be found at the end of this article.

Why split an area code?

To understand what prompts the formation of new area codes, telephone
numbers in North America consist of a seven digit local number in a
three digit area code (formally known as a Numbering Plan Area or
NPA), such as [phone]. The first three digits of a local number
are called a prefix, exchange or central office (CO) code (the term
"CO code" will be used for this article). A finite number of CO codes
can be assigned to each area code, theoretically 800 maximum
(8 * 10 * 10, given that the first digit cannot be 0 or 1, due to
their use for operator, long distance, etc). Since codes like 911 and
FidoNews 10-38                 Page:  9                    20 Sep 1993

411 are used for special services, the maximum will be less than 800.
When nearly all of the available CO codes are in use in an area code,
the only way to expand numbering capacity is to create a new area
code (ie. split the area code).

Who assigns area codes?

The assignment of area codes in the NANP is the responsibility of New
Jersey-based Bell Communications Research (Bellcore), jointly owned by
the U.S. Bell Operating Companies (e.g. Ameritech, NYNEX, Pacific Bell).
Bellcore's role as NANP Administrator resulted from the divestiture of
AT&T in the early 1980s. Recent reports indicate that Bellcore wants to
abandon responsibility for maintaining the area codes and other aspects
of the NANP within the next 18 months; at the moment it is unclear how
the NANP will be maintained if this occurs.

The original telephone numbering format...

Area codes have 0 or 1 as the middle digit (416, 905, 212, 809, etc).
Originally, this allowed telephone company equipment to distinguish
area codes from CO codes. That meant calls within an area code could
be dialed using just the seven digit number and calls placed to other
area codes were dialed as 1 + area code + number.

New CO codes needed...

In July 1973, Los Angeles (area code 213) allowed CO codes with 0 or 1
as the middle digit, increasing the number of CO codes that could be
assigned within 213 area, and forestalling an area code split. Other
area codes were set up with this format where extra capacity was needed.
When these "interchangeable" CO codes were introduced, dialing changes
were needed to reflect the loss of distinction between area codes and
CO codes. In some cases, 1+ indicated a call outside the area code,
while all calls within the area code were seven digits (without 1+).
In others, long distance within an area code was changed to require
1+area code on all calls including those within the area code.

New *area* codes needed...

With all the splits, there would eventually be no more area codes
available under the current format. Starting January 1995, the NANP
format will allow for digits other than 0 or 1 in the middle of an
area code. The distinction between and area code and a CO code will
be lost throughout North America at that time. Dialing changes will
be made in all area codes except those that have the interchangeable
CO codes. The changes to dialing will depend on the particular phone
company. The first of the "interchangeable" area codes is reported
to be 334, to split Alabama's current 205 area code.

10 digit local calling...

In the 416/905 split, local calls across the 416/905 boundary will
have to be dialed as ten digits. That is, calls from Toronto to
local points in 905 will be dialed as 905+number, and calls from
905 to local points in 416 will be dialed as 416+number. There is
FidoNews 10-38                 Page: 10                    20 Sep 1993

no 1+ dialed before local numbers; just a new ten digit local
calling format.

Bellcore published a document on the future of the NANP recommending
that ten digit local dialing be made the norm everywhere. In fact,
there is even a recommendation to remove 1+ as a toll indicator, so
that all calls, whether local or long distance, are dialed as ten
digits. This is not an official rule at present, and this plan has
certain advantages (a common dialing method for North America for
any NANP call) and certain controversies (consumer acceptance of
ten digits, complications in determining whether a call is toll
or local, dialing errors may incur more risks, etc.).

The document mentioned above is called "North American Numbering Plan
Administrator's Proposal on the Future of Numbering in WZ1 - Second
Edition", letter IL-93/01-008. [The WZ1 means World Zone 1, or NANP].
Write NANP Administration, Bellcore, 290 West Mt Pleasant Avenue,
Livingston NJ USA 07039; This was available for free, as an
openly-distributed industry proposal.

Internationally...

North America is not the only place having numbering plan overhauls.
The following is list (not a complete one) of numbering changes in
other countries.

London, UK also had a recent area code split of its own, replacing the
area code 1 with two new codes 71 (inner London) and 81 (outer London).
This is nothing compared to the changes proposed in April 1995 where
almost all geographic area codes will have the digit 1 added at the
beginning. That means London's 71 and 81 codes will become 171 and
181, while Birmingham's 21 becomes 121. (Within the UK, long distance
would be dialed with the 0 in front, as 071, 081, 021; the area codes
are listed as they would be used to call the UK from other countries).

Australia will be changing its area codes in the next few years and
converting to a new numbering plan. New Zealand already has in place
a new numbering system with single digit area codes and seven digit
numbers.

Even Eastern Europe is changing its numbering plans:

- Last November, Romania overhauled its numbering plan so that
Bucharest's area code 0 was changed to 1, and all other area codes
had the digit 9 prepended to them.
- Country codes are also split to reflect the breakup of nations:
Yugoslavia was country code 38, but as of 1 October 1993 it will be
split into 381 Serbia and Montenegro, 385 Croatia, 386 Slovenia,
387 Bosnia and 389 Macedonia.
- Some of the former Soviet nations are already operating under new
country codes. In Germany's case, the old East Germany country code 37
was taken out of service and country code 49 now serves all of Germany.

Implications for Fidonet...

FidoNews 10-38                 Page: 11                    20 Sep 1993

Fidonet sysops should be aware of any upcoming changes to local or
long distance dialing methods and adjust their dialing strings, config
files, etc accordingly.

When area codes change, the phone company usually has a grace period
where the old area codes co-exist with the new. There is no need to
rush with nodelist area code changes; remember that phone companies
in other areas, even other countries, may not be ready for a new area
code right away. This should not prevent sysops from testing new
dialing methods in their own territories; the prime responsibility
for keeping nodelist phone numbers current would seem to rest with
the regional nets in any case.

Announcement of area code or country code changes could be made
through the Fidonews or other official Fidonet channels. This would
help sysops keep dialing and cost tables current.

List of area code splits...

Carl Moore (Internet [e-mail]) maintains a history of area code
splits and other changes to the dialing plan in the NANP. Those with
access to Internet FTP capabilities may obtain the full list from the
site lcs.mit.edu, go to the "telecom-archives" directory, then the get
the "history.of.area.splits" file. On Fidonet, this can be F'reqd from
1:250/730, file name ACSPLIT.TXT. The most recent version is dated
28 July 1993.

The following is an excerpt from that list for the area code splits
announced or in effect since January 1992:

212/718/917 New York, 1 Jan 1992 (917, to be overlaid on
     212 & 718, is to be used for cellular & pagers)
404/706 Georgia, 3 May 1992 (full cutover 3 Aug 1992)
512/210 Texas, 1 Nov 1992 (full cutover 1 May 1993)
714/909 California, 14 Nov 1992 (full cutover 14 Aug 1993)
    (Riverside and San Bernardino counties go into 909;
     Orange County remains in 714)
416/905 Ontario, 4 Oct 1993 (full cutover Mar 1994,
    postponed from 10 Jan 1994)
919/910 North Carolina, 14 Nov 1993 (full cutover 13 Feb 1994)
313/810 Michigan, 1 Dec 1993 (full cutover 10 Aug 1994)
215/610 Pennsylvania, 1994
205/334 Alabama, 1995 (the first NNX area code to be announced, on
    July 22, 1993)

Finally....

Acknowledgements are due to: Bellcore, Carl Moore ([e-mail]),
Telecom Digest/comp.dcom.telecom newsgroup, Thomas Diessel
([e-mail]) for Yugoslavia information.

By way of blatant plug, Fidonet does have a telecom echo called MDF.
Those interested in telephone system discussions might wish to pick
this up (it should be available on the backbone). The FCC echo also
had some numbering plan discussions recently.
FidoNews 10-38                 Page: 12                    20 Sep 1993


For another plug, there are files of the CO codes involved in the
416/905 split. NEW416.LST and NEW905.LST represent the exchanges in
416 and 905 area codes as split and may be file requested from
1:250/730. These files are not mandatory for sysops since the
nodelists will reflect the splitting area codes anyway; they are
made available for those interested.

Hopefully this article will provide some information about the
changes to occur and spark some discussion and readiness on the
part of sysops. Comments and further discussion are encouraged.

# # #

David Leibold
Fidonet:  1:250/730
Internet: [e-mail] or [e-mail]


----------------------------------------------------------------------

Info-ZIP utility - a .ZIP alternative

Info-ZIP

Introduced by David Leibold 1:250/730

The .ZIP format for file archive/compression appears to be the most
prevalent form of compression in Fidonet. The Info-ZIP project seeks
to provide .ZIP compression for many types of computers. The programs
and source code developed under the Info-ZIP banner are also free
to use and distribute for non-profit purposes.

The work on Info-ZIP occurs on Internet. Perhaps a similar support
and development effort should be started on Fidonet, and/or set
up the Internet Info-Zip discussions as gatewayed echoes. Support
and distribution of Info-ZIP can alleviate concerns about .ZIP
programs being primarily shareware.

Info-ZIP's new program release is described below, as announced
on an Info-ZIP mailing list. Note that the files are available
through the Internet; they are not available on my node (1:250/730)
at this time. Those with direct Internet access may get the files
as described below. Inquiries may be made Internet e-mail to Hunter
Goatley ([e-mail]).

 . . . . . . . . . . .

X-ListName: Info-ZIP Announcements <[e-mail]>
Errors-To: [e-mail]
Sender: [e-mail]
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
To: Keith Petersen <[e-mail]>,
    Timo Salmi <[e-mail]>,
    Ari Hovila <[e-mail]>, [e-mail],
FidoNews 10-38                 Page: 13                    20 Sep 1993

    [e-mail]
CC: [e-mail]
Subject: Info-zip zip 2.0 is available
Date: Tue, 14 Sep 93 18:49:47 +0200
From: Jean-loup Gailly <[e-mail]>
Reply-To: [e-mail]

The Info-zip group has released zip version 2.0.

Zip 2.0 is a compression and file packaging utility.  It is compatible
with PKZIP 2.04g (Phil Katz ZIP) for MSDOS systems.  There is a
companion to zip called unzip (of course) which you should be able to
find at the same place as zip. Unzip 5.0p1 was released on 12 January
1993 and can extract zip files created by zip 2.0.

This version of zip has been ported to a wide array of Unix and other
systems including VMS, OS/2, TOPS20, Minix, MSDOS, Windows NT, Atari
and Amiga.

Main changes since zip 1.9p1:

- new -i option (include only the following names).
- new -T option to test zip file integrity before overwriting original
- new -F and -FF (zipfix) options
- new -D option (do not create entries for directories)
- new -S option to include hidden/system files on MSDOS and OS/2
- new -$ option to include a volume label on MSDOS and OS/2
- new -ll option for CR LF to LF translation
- new -p option for zipsplit (pause between diskettes)
- speed up for the fast options (-1 to -3)
- support for new systems (Amiga, TOPS 20, Human68k, ...)
- many portability improvements
- many bug fixes

The following files are available. Some ftp sites may not have
the executables for all systems. See the file Where in zip20.zip or
zip20x.zip for details on ftp sites.

Sources for all systems (first column is the size in bytes):

245012 zip20.zip      Info-zip zip 2.0 sources (no crypt support)
 17077 zcrypt20.zip   Crypt sources for zip 2.0 and unzip 5.0p1

MSDOS executables:

176302 zip20x.zip     Info-zip zip 2.0 MSDOS exe (no crypt)
155668 zcryp20x.zip   Info-zip zip 2.0 MSDOS exe (with crypt)

VMS (Vax and AXP) executables:

195590 zip20x-vms.zip Info-zip zip 2.0 VMS exe, VAX & AXP

OS/2 executables:

119533 zip20x32.zip   Info-zip zip 2.0 OS/2 32-bit exe (no crypt)
FidoNews 10-38                 Page: 14                    20 Sep 1993

148267 zip20c32.zip   Info-zip zip 2.0 OS/2 32-bit exe (with crypt)
106085 zip20x16.zip   Info-zip zip 2.0 OS/2 16-bit exe (no crypt)
129689 zip20c16.zip   Info-zip zip 2.0 OS/2 16-bit exe (with crypt)

Amiga executables:

131913 zip20x.lha     Info-zip zip 2.0 Amiga executables
130234 zip20x.zip     Info-zip zip 2.0 Amiga executables

Important note:

The encryption code was written in Europe and can be freely
distributed from any country except the U.S.A. People outside the
U.S.A must get the encryption sources and executables from a European
site such as ftp.informatik.tu-muenchen.de:/pub/comp/os/os2/archiver
or garbo.uwasa.fi or ftp.win.tue.nl:/pub/compression/zip.

Send problem reports to [e-mail] or
[e-mail].

The info-zip group,
[e-mail]


----------------------------------------------------------------------

EPubNet - Electronic Publishing Pioneers
by Dave Bealer (1:261/1129)

As mentioned in last week's FidoNews, I have been publishing an
electronic magazine for a whole year now.  When starting Random
Access Humor I was on my own; the only electronic publications I had
been exposed to were FidoNews and ModemNews Magazine.  Both these
publications had their influences on my work, although RAH stands
alone as a unique publication.

As time went by I became aware of other electronic publications such
as Ruby's Pearls, an "Elec-mag" specializing in short fiction.  But I
was still not aware of how many people around the world were laboring
over their own electronic publications.  I worked alone on RAH for
about five months before being invited to join the Electronic
Publishing Network (EPubNet).  EPubNet is a group of sysops who use
their FidoNet node numbers to exchange message and file echoes on
many topics involving electronic publishing (epub).

EPubNet message echo topics include: Publishing electronically;
Writing for Epubs; Running an Electronic Bookstore; Electronic
authoring tools/readers.  EPubNet file echoes (which reside on the
Filebone) include such areas as: electronic magazines; electronic
books; electronic texts (including Project Gutenberg etexts), and
electronic authoring tools/readers.

EPubNet users can communicate directly with some of the leaders of
the budding epub industry, including the editors of e-mags and the
authors of publishing tools such as the Readroom BBS Door.
FidoNews 10-38                 Page: 15                    20 Sep 1993


Those interested in epub can obtain the EPubNet information file
(EPUBINFO.ARJ) from the following hub systems:

SYSOP           LOCATION           NODE NUMBER    SPEED

ZONE 1
  Tom Almy        Tigard, OR         1:105/290      14400 v.32bis
  Dave Bealer     Pasadena, MD       1:261/1129     14400 v.32bis
                                                    16800 HST
  Mike Taylor     Philadelphia, PA   1:273/937       9600 v.32
                                                    14400 HST
  N.L. Hargrove   Los Lunas, NM      1:317/100       9600 v.32
                                     1:317/317      16800 HST
  John Mudge      Shelton, WA        1:352/111      14400 v.32bis

ZONE 2
  Franck Arnaud   Paris, France      2:320/100      14400 v.32bis
  Henk Ellermann  Heerlen, Holland   2:512/62       14400 v.32bis

(Sysops can FREQ the info file by name or by the "magic name" of
 EPUBINFO from any of the above sites)

Although not generally recognized by the mainstream publishing
industry, epub has the potential to become the hot small press
phenomenon of the 90's.  Catch the epub wave while it's still in the
"working out of the garage" phase.  Once epub hits the "working out
of the board room" phase, it will be too late.

----------------------------------------------------------------------

"The Fight for Privacy: The Govt. Raises the Stakes"
Stanton McCandlish,
NitV DataCenter 1:301/2 (until Sept. 20)
[e-mail]

[Apologies for the length of this piece. However the issues, to US
nodes at least, are far more important than preliminary backbone
policies or griping about nodelist flags.]

The Clipper fiasco has just escalated. A lot. Our "representatives"
in the Casa Blanca and on the hill have shown their true colours.

A bit of background for the few who don't know about this yet: In a
"proposal" this summer, Clinton announced the creation of the
Clipper/Capstone/Skipjack "encryption" "standard". This scheme uses
a secret algorithm, for both voice and data encryption in all
applications, which has not been reviewed for security publicly by
cryptography experts. There is no doubt in the mind of the vast
majority of such professionals that Clipper is intentionally weak and
has built in "backdoors", in addition to the publicly- announced
backdoor:  Key  escrow.  This  procedure places half of YOUR
cryptographic key in the hands of one "escrow agency", and half in
another, so that "law enforcement agencies" (not to metion any
cracker worth the title) can get their hands on the keys to YOUR
FidoNews 10-38                 Page: 16                    20 Sep 1993

privacy, wire tap you at will, and read all of your files, regardless
if you have not been convicted of a crime, or even charged. And not
just the relevant material.  ANYTHING you have EVER used this
"encryption" on will be like a book for the SS and police to leaf
through at will.

"What do I care?" Believe me, you will care. In less than 5 years it
is expected that most telephones and modems, and a great deal of the
software we use every day, will have built in encryption. It is
almost inevitable, as this country's industries lose BILLIONS every
year to industrial espionage. This totalitarian move by Big Bro will
set the most horrifying precedent for government invasion of privacy
this country has ever seen. And do not be fooled by any rhetoric
from the government about Clipper being "voluntary". Ostensibly the
purpose of the Clipper chip is to catch "drug dealers, terrorists,
and child pronographers" (Of course. I mean we ALL know these evil
minions of Satan himself are lurking on every street corner, and we
all know they are STUPID enough to use "cryptography" that they know
is compromised, with the cops listening it. Puh-leeeze. And the
Reds are coming too, and there really IS a Santa Claus.) The ONLY way
the Privacy- Clipper could be even imagined to be effective is if ALL
OTHER CRYPTOGRAPHY IS BANNED. Yes that's right. And we all can see
QUITE clearly that the real purpose of these chips is to spy upon the
American populace.

Another dire result of this action, should it become law, is that it
will utterly destroy the cryptography industry in this country,
literally throwing away many people's jobs. Europe is already in the
lead in cryptographic applications, unhampered by ludicrous export
regulations that classify privacy software as dangerous "munitions",
putting crypto under the purview of our beloved BATF. And we all
know how much they wish to "serve and protect" by burning women and
children to death for failing to bow down for the bootheel. In
addition, ALL US industries will suffer staggering losses, as
Japanese,  Indian, European, Korean industrial spies steal our
technology, again and again and again.

Oh, don't get me wrong, someone will benefit. AT&T is supporting the
Clipper scheme, since they have an exclusive license to make Clipper
phones. Yes, the faceless corporate monster that charges you ten
times what telephone service should cost, that colludes with "law
enforcement" to tap the phones of anyone they care to tap, are to be
entrusted with YOUR privacy and rights. PKP/RSADSI (Public Key
Partners/RSA Data Security, Inc., more commonly known as PKP or RSA)
will also benefit. Their allies in the government have allowed them
to claim algorithm patents on almost all cryptography applications.
Yep you heard right.  The government has granted OWNERSHIP of
PROPERTIES OF MATHEMATICS, POSSESSION of NATURAL PROCESSES OF THE
UNIVERSE. What next? Will GE be handed a deed to sunlight? Perhaps I
should apply for a copyright on the laws of physics? This ludicrous
and reprehensible action has resulted in PKP/RSI gaining an almost
complete monopoly on crytographic applications in the US. I my self
have received legal threats (you are welcome to a copy if you like)
from RSA for daring to use non-RSA freeware cryptography software.

FidoNews 10-38                 Page: 17                    20 Sep 1993

Recently, NIST, yet another government four-letter-agency, and more
or less a branch of the NSA, has attempted to grant RSA an EXCLUSIVE
license to government cryptography standards such as DSA and DSS.
This crypto was developed with YOUR tax money, and is now to be given
to a private company to SELL back to you. Do you like paying for
things twice?  Do you like to see monopolies conspiring with the
federal government to rape your privacy? This action is in blatant
violation of federal law, as are NSA's refusals, even in the face of
repeated direct court orders, to yield up information, as required by
the Freedom of Information Act (FOIA) about Clipper and other privacy
matters (such as their involvement with the FBI's "Digital Telephony"
wiretap bill, which aimed to cripple all future communications
technology and hamper development to the point of uselessness, to
ensure that it will always be as easy to spy on peasants like you and
me as it is now.) The actions of organizations like the ACLU and EFF,
and individuals like YOU, defeated the FBI scheme, repeatedly. It
can also stomp the NIST/PKP scandal, and the Clipper scheme in its
entirety, but only if you act NOW.  Do something about this
immediately, or your children and grandchildren, perhaps even you
yourself, will live in a world far less pleasant than that envisioned
by George Orwell. This is NOT a joke, it will NOT go away, wasting
your time watching Cheers reruns will NOT protect YOUR rights. This
is a war. It is bloodless, and behind the scenes, but it is no less
a battle than the American Revolution, and the reasons are almost
identical.

Are you angry? You should be. Read on. As of this writing, the US
government has announced who it has chosen to be the "key escrow
agents" for the Clipper scheme (and please note that NO ONE IN THIS
COUNTRY got to vote on this matter -- if you really believe you still
live in a democracy, you have been lied to). Early on in the "game",
the govt. assured all who were concerned that the key escrow agents
(nevermind that the vast majority of people who were "allowed" to
"comment" on the matter, and whose demands were utterly ignored by
our sneering "representatives", decided that no escrow was needed,
because no damned crippled crypto from the SuperSpook spy house would
be tolerated) would be private companies with no connections to the
govt.,  so  the  populace could be assured that corrupt "law
enforcement" and "anti-terrorist" agents would not misuse the keys to
our privacy.  Did this happen? Of course not. The White House has
announced that one of the escrow agents is to be NIST itself, who
have a vested (and conflict of) interest in at once devising and
spreading insecure communications encryption to make it easy for
their Big Brothers, NSA, CIA, FBI, and SS, spy upon us, while also
proposing to protect our rights and privacy from just such voyeurism.
And the other escrow agent? Try an "unspecified" sub-agency of the
Treasury department. Yes, that's right. The people that brought you
the Prohibition, the Waco Massacre, the outright theft of anything
brought into this country that they do not approve of, the robbing
and destruction of publishers and BBSs all over the country, and
(imagine that) legal threats and harrassment of people daring to use
non-crippled, private cryptography for their own uses. How is all
this possible? Keep in mind that the Treasury controls:

The Secret Service. Responsible for the (by now infamous) Steve
FidoNews 10-38                 Page: 18                    20 Sep 1993

Jackson Games case, and the dreaded and sickening Operation Sundevil,
resulting in the destruction of several BBSs, and lives, in the cause
of charging people with the "theft" of a telco document which, in a
blatant and perjurous lie, was valued at over a hundred thousand
dollars, but which ANY person in this country can buy directly from
the phone company for under TWENTY dollars. Perhaps the SS should
stick to what it does best: catching bullets for the Prez. Then
again, remembering Kennedy, perhaps they can't even  do  THAT
competently.  The SJG case resulted in a resounding court victory
against the SS, and it's not over yet.

The Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco and Firearms.  Surely a great
combination,  especially  coupled  with  our  corrupt Treasury.
Responsible for a variety of atrocities, but most notably the Waco
Massacre, in which about 80 US citizens were denied their right to
bear arms, and their right to freedom of religion. They were burned
to death, men, women, and children, while the BATF told blatant and
obvious lies to the media and to YOU.

The Customs Department.  The agency directly  responsible  for
enforcing "export restrictions" on cryptography, in defiance of all
logic and basic common sense. Encryption packages, unless Govt.
Approved (TM), even if MADE OUTSIDE THE US AND IMPORTED, cannot be
exported, lest The Evil Bad Guys (R) get ahold of it. Nevermind the
simple and inescable fact that in most cases they WROTE it in the
first place. Almost simultaneous with the announcement of the escrow
agents, was the issuing of several subpoenas by US Customs, to haul
in people using PGP encryption, even those LICENSED by the "patent"
holder, our friendly RSA, to do so.

SO, yes the ante has just been upped. But they are bluffing. The
American people have a royal flush. It's called the United States
Constitution and the Bill of Rights. WE have the right, the DUTY, to
ensure that our government serves us, not the other way around.  The
govt.  exists because we allow it to, and it answers to us. It will
answer to us, and to YOU, so DO SOMETHING ABOUT IT NOW. Don't take a
nap, don't watch Oprah, don't have lunch, don't go out dancing. Sit
down RIGHT NOW, if you care for your rights at all, and draft a short
note to your congresspersons, your president, and all of the local
newsmedia. If you don't feel up to this, or would simply like more
information before deciding that YOU are responsible for YOUR rights,
and no one will defend them for you, then call NitV-BBS (+1-505-246-
8515) [new node number to be announced in October] or Jungle BBS
([phone]:301/36 and download BIGBRO?.ZIP (there are 4 of
them at this writing.) In conjunction with the file EFF8-30.ZIP, also
available from NitV), you'll find well over  a  megabyte  of
information, debate, commentary, analysis, reports, articles and
more, from both sides of the Clipper debate, in addition to sample
letters to send to your "representatives", hints on how to use the
media, info on the Electronic Frontier Foundation and related civil
rights organizations you should belong to or support in any way you
can, and lots more besides. You can FREQ these files from NitV
(1:302/2,  369:101/1)  as  BIGBRO.ZIP, BIGBRO2.ZIP, BIGBRO3.ZIP,
BIGBRO4.ZIP (or get them all at once with the "magicname" BIGBRO.
EFF8-30.ZIP must be FREQed separately). If you do not wish to login
FidoNews 10-38                 Page: 19                    20 Sep 1993

with your real name, you may login as ANONYMOUS, password GUEST. You
may also be interested in the UNcrippled cryptography applications
available at NitV. Due to our favourite US export restrictions,
crypto files are unfortunately available only to US and Canadian
nodes.

THE TIME IS *NOW*.

Are you scared? You should be. If you are not, read this again, and
get those files, and read them until you understand. Then you will
be. Maybe that's what it takes. And it will be worth it.  ANYTHING
will be worth demonstrating to our supposed masters that the American
people will NOT tolerate a regime of bureacrats that think they are
above the law and can act as judge, jury and executioner rolled into
one.

DISCLAIMER: At this time I speak ONLY for myself, and my statements
do NOT represent the Electronic Frontier Foundation or any other
organization.

Area Netmail, Msg#244, Sep-17-93 23:41:50
   From: Stanton McCandlish                   (1:301/2)
     To: Editor                               (1:1/23)
Subject: article

"CORRECTION, re: Clipper article"
Stanton McCandlish, 1:301/2 (until Sept. 23), [e-mail]

I'd like to correct an error in my article concerning the govt's
"Clipper" scheme. The telco document of importance in the Steve
Jackson Games case was valued at over $80,000, not over
$100,000. Sorry about that. This error was pointed out by Bill
Verant at 1:317/50. Also, an update on the very recent news of
the  Customs  subpoenas clarifies that it was not simply
individuals that are being hassled by the Treasury, but entire,
legitimate, companies. EFF has issued a public statement in
defense of those who have been subpoena'd, stating that they
have done precisely NOTHING that is illegal. In the personal
opinion of this writer, the  actions  on  the  part  of
Customs/Treasury  can  be  viewed as nothing but outright
harrassment.

Don't stand for it.
FidoNews 10-38                 Page: 20                    20 Sep 1993


"ZIP Archivers Update"
Stanton McCandlish, NitV DataCenter, 1:301/2 until Oct.

Those of you wishing to get the latest ZIP format archivers from
my system, please hold off for a while. I've been offered a job
in DC, and will be moving out there within the month. My system
will be back online with a new node number ASAP, and I will post
a list of the latest ZIPers when they are available again. Some
of these will include versions for VMS, VAX, and AIX, plus
updates of the Amiga versions, and some other goodies, including
some  source  code for various platforms.  If Fido won't
officially  adopt  ZIP  as  the  new  standard  for
archiving/compression, lets simply make ZIP a defacto standard.
Where practicality and policy meet, practicality wins. Hands
down.

----------------------------------------------------------------------

The Joy of FidoNet!
By: Eric Jones (1:3623/12)

  I've always read in FidoNews, and on the various conferences on
FidoNet, that the *Cs were "real jerks." Until just last week, I had
no intentions of EVER joining FidoNet or a FTN Network. I run VBBS
(I know, it's not a 'FidoNet' BBS), and so far had been content to
stick with VirtualNET. But I figured, since VBBS features multi-net
capabilities (VNET, Fido, WWIV, UUCP), I'd use them, and join the
local FidoNet here in Daytona (Net 3623).

  Well, I downloaded the info on DaytonaNet, and filled out the
info required. I set up my software to toss Fido-style messages and
netmailed my node request to the NC. When I joined VNET, it took 2
weeks to get a node number, and after 2 months, I couldn't receive
certain types of messages, because of a mess up in the VBBS nodelist
upline from me. Well, about 30 seconds or so after netmailing Brian
Elia (our NC), I received a phone call from him, telling me that my
request had been received, and that he had a node number ready for me.

  I set up the info I got from Brian, and later that night, was
receiving echomail from his bbs. I guess not everything one reads is
true, or if it is, it is not widespread. I'm happy with FidoNet, and
don't think I'll ever give it up.

  This article was a spur-of-the-moment thing, and I had no
intention of writing to FidoNews when I joined (even though I read
every FNEWS). I just figured this was the kind of thing that should
be told to everyone, and I think our NC should be recognized for his
great work.

----------------------------------------------------------------------

Replies to FidoNews 10-36
By: Eric Jones (1:3623/12)

FidoNews 10-38                 Page: 21                    20 Sep 1993

  This is basically some replies to things from FidoNews 10-36.
And yes, I know that FidoNews 10-37 has come and gone, (I got both
10-36 and 10-37 at the same time from ftp.ieee.org, today 9/13).
Well, here they are, hope they are good enough for you! :)

  Nodelist Flags: Isn't the nodelist hard enough to use as it is?
I have a 2-something megabyte file sitting in my netmail directory
mainly wasting space.  And no, I haven't been able to take out the
irrelevant sections, because QEdit won't load it all.  More flags
just mean more disk space, because, in case you haven't noticed, a
lot of the flags already in use are not needed for certain entries,
and they are just overkill on the part of the person who added them
to the entry in the first place.

  Compression Utility for Fido Telling people what they NEED to use
may not necessarily be what they WANT to use. Take me for example.
My archiver of choice happens to be ARJ (not for speed  or
compression, just because I like the features). So what if you can
get a ZIP utility for every computer made? Maybe there is a sysop
out there who has a 1.2GB hard drive who has been on FidoNet since
the beginning, and who is a die-hard ARC fan. Do you really think
you are going to force him to use ZIP just because it is the official
archiver? NOPE! He'll just find someone who will ARC the file for
him before it is sent.  He has the drive space to waste, and he
probably has a 14.4+ modem too, so the extra few bytes aren't going
to raise his phone bill much.

  Democracy and XAB and PCs Democracy? On Fido? From what I have
seen in the last two years or so of being a user on FidoNet boards, I
have yet to see democracy. It will always be the person higher up on
the ladder who has the final say. Just look at the US government (or
any other government). An example would be something like: a state
makes a law that someone doesn't like, so they take it to a higher
court trying to get it overturned, who in turn goes up, until they
get to the highest court in the land, who strikes down the law.
Until all, and I do mean all, of the sysops in FidoNet take a stand
and change POLICY4, nothing is going to happen.  From what I
understand, this is an AMATEUR/HOBBYIST NETWORK, and if it weren't
for all of us 'lowly' sysops, there would be no FidoNet. It's people
like us who made this net what it is, and no one person (ZC, RC, NC)
can take credit for that. It was a collective endeavour over many
years, and many many man-hours of people trying to enjoy THEIR hobby.
When you take away their rights, you create anarchy.

  Also about this XAB thing, it's really annoying! :) All I see is:
He's annoying!  She's annoying!  NC, I think this is Annoying
behavior! Do something about it, or we'll replace you with someone
who will!  Define Annoying Behavior. Everyone is annoying sometime
during their lives. It's human nature. Excommunicating a node just
because somebody 'in power' doesn't like people who deviate from
their norms is taking someone's hobby and throwing it out of the
window.  On other networks, I have seen people say "I decided to use
this software, because blah-blah-blah is Fido-compatible software,
and I hate Fido because of their stupid rules about XAB, so I got
this program to run this net, where people don't mind annoying
FidoNews 10-38                 Page: 22                    20 Sep 1993

people."

  And finally, the thing about Policy Complaints. Policy 4 sucks!
Yes, you heard it from me! Flame me, I wanna hear your dumb replies
:>.  I can't understand a word of it. It looks like it was written
by lawyers and law-makers. Gimme a break, why the hell do we need
'Congress' to make rules for a bunch of people enjoying the use of
their computers. Make it easy, and people will obey it.  Make it
hard to decypher, people will ignore it.

  Ok, I'll quit my verbal diarrhea now. Just wanted to get this
off my mind, and maybe I'll go away for a while and leave everyone
alone. (But I doubt it). Direct all flames to the address listed at
the beginning of the article.

----------------------------------------------------------------------

(The Innocents)
By: Scott Bernard 1:107/653

Have you ever, while writing a game, come across some problem you
couldn't solve?  You probably went posted a little something about
your problem in a Programming Echo, like C_ECHO, or 80XXX, but
reponses either had nothing really in particular to do with what you
asked, or the Moderator told you that your question was Off-Topic,
and to correspond through Netmail. Thats fine and all, but you doubt
she/he'd let you get away with it a second time.

Its obvious an Echo is needed specifically for the writing of Games.
The topic just needs to be addressed. There's nowhere you can really
goto to get help on programming project of this sort. More or less,
cause is more than just programming.  Its more Problem Solving.
Figuring out how to get what you want out of the PC.

Sure this is true for almost every sort of programming project, but
Game writting is more demanding than most projects. You need to know
about graphics, about  low-level  hardware  interaction,  about
simulations, etc.

An Echo full of this stuff would be a real asset to any programmer.
So, obviously, one has to be established.

I've been trying for a few weeks now to get this echo started.  If
you think this Echo is what you or your users need, then please,
Netmail me at 1:107/653.

----------------------------------------------------------------------

========================================================================
                          Fidonews Information
========================================================================

FidoNews 10-38                 Page: 23                    20 Sep 1993


------- FIDONEWS MASTHEAD AND CONTACT INFORMATION ----------------

Editors: Sylvia Maxwell, Donald Tees, Tim Pozar
Editors Emeritii: Thom Henderson, Dale Lovell, Vince Perriello,
                             Tom Jennings

IMPORTANT NOTE: The FidoNet address of the FidoNews BBS has been
changed!!! Please make a note of this.

"FidoNews" BBS
    FidoNet  1:1/23
    BBS  [phone],  300/1200/2400/14400/V.32bis/HST(DS)
 Internet addresses:
    Don & Sylvia    (submission address)
              [e-mail]

    Sylvia -- [e-mail]
    Donald -- [e-mail]
    Tim    -- [e-mail]

(Postal Service mailing address) (have extreme patience)
    FidoNews
    172 Duke St. E.
    Kitchener, Ontario
    Canada
    N2H 1A7

Published weekly by and for the members of the FidoNet international
amateur electronic mail system. It is a compilation of individual
articles contributed by their authors or their authorized agents. The
contribution of articles to this compilation does not diminish the
rights of the authors. Opinions expressed in these articles are those
of the authors and not necessarily those of FidoNews.

Authors retain copyright on individual works; otherwise FidoNews is
copyright 1993 Sylvia Maxwell. All rights reserved.  Duplication and/or
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FidoNews 10-38                 Page: 24                    20 Sep 1993

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    Asked what he thought of Western civilization,
    M.K. Gandhi said, "I think it would be an excellent idea".
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